[image_credit]REUTERS/Carlos Barria[/image_credit][image_caption]President Donald Trump[/image_caption]
His most recent short piece, published by the Boston Globe, looked at how Donald Trump’s lie that the election was being stolen from him and the fact that a large minority of Americans who are members of Trump’s cult believe it, and how it fits into the larger challenge facing American democracy.
If the losing side in an election clings to the belief that the election was stolen, that belief is a breeding ground for a great many negative attitudes that are now proliferating among the perhaps up to 40 percent of the electorate who are sturdy Trumpists.
The headline of the Globe piece, linked below, is “Trump’s big election lie pushes America toward autocracy.” In it, Snyder draws analogies to the interwar period in Germany, when Adolf Hitler and the Nazis rose in part by arguing that Germany had not lost World War I on the battlefield, but that Jews and other internal enemies had conspired to surrender when the war could have been won. That falsehood was known as “the stab in the back.”
Snyder picks up on the dangers from the millions of Trump-loving Americans who believe that the president didn’t lose. Among those conspiracy theorists Snyder mentions is former Speaker of the House Newt Gingrich, who said on Fox News that the theft is being “financed by people like George Soros,” a wealthy Jew whose name is sometimes used to bring anti-Semitism into right-wing rhetoric.
Writes Snyder:
The German myth of a stab in the back did not doom German democracy immediately. But the conspiracy theory did help Nazis make their case that some Germans were not truly members of the nation and that a truly national government could not be democratic…
Democracy can be buried in a big lie. Of course, the end of democracy in America would take an American form. In 2020 Trump acknowledged openly what has been increasingly clear for decades: The Republican Party aims not so much to win elections as to game them.
This strategy has its temptations: The more you care about suppressing votes, the less you care about what voters want. And the less you care about what voters want, the closer you move to authoritarianism. Trump has taken the next logical step: Try to disenfranchise voters not only before but after elections.
The results of the 2020 elections could be read to mean that Republicans can fight and win on the issues. Reading the results as fraudulent instead will take Republicans, and the country, on a very different journey, through a cloud of magical thinking toward violence.
If you have been stabbed in the back, then everything is permitted. Claiming that a fair election was foul is preparation for an election that is foul. If you convince your voters that the other side has cheated, you are promising them that you yourself will cheat next time. Having bent the rules, you then have to break them. History shows the danger in the familiar example of Hitler. When politicians break democracy, as conservatives in Weimar Germany did in the early 1930s, they are wrong to think that they will control what happens next. Someone else will emerge who is better adapted to the chaos and who will wield it in ways that they neither want nor expect. The myth of victimhood comes home and claims its victims.
Snyder’s full Boston Globe piece is here.
It’s worth remembering that in the case of Germany, the alleged “stab in the back” happened in 1918, as did the creation of the myth. Hitler didn’t come to power until 1933.
It’s possible, but hard to imagine someone in Germany in 1918 saying something like: “I’m glad the government decided to surrender, but I wonder if we should have waited longer, lost more battles and more troops, so it would be clear to the hard-liners that we had no realistic chance of winning the war.”
But in the later ’30s and into the war years after Germany started losing, the opposite lesson seemed to have landed. The Nazis fought on and on, wasting tens or hundreds of thousands of lives on both sides, until the country was almost totally destroyed.
It’s creepy how committed most of the Trumpers are to continuing their MAGA war. But at least, for now, the battle is in the legal and political arenas. Few lives, if any, are being lost, unless you count COVID.
I see that Snyder conveniently leaves out context. Nazi’s did not rise to power in Germany in a vacuum. The “winners” of WWI were not content in defeating Germany, they meant to crush them so as to never let them rise again (the opposite happened). Punishing sanctions on Germany left the German people in abject poverty and a state of degradation and despair. Such a treatment is fertile ground for fascists. The righteous winners of WWI much caused the rise of Nazi’s.
A similar thing is happening in America, but different. Both parties embraced economics for forty years that were devastating to working people. After 2008, the banks and bankers and equities were saved and the people were cast into a sea of sharks. Many Americans descended into despair. Out of that long-building despair arose Trump.
As for not accepting the election, Democrats generally did not accept the outcome of the 2016 election, and used “Russian collusion” as a means to initiate a soft coup. So the precedent was set.
Such cycles will continue as long as Democrats want to paint themselves in righteousness and conservatives with swastikas; and conservatives paint themselves in righteousness and democrats in communism.
I recommend the late Joachim Fest’s biography of Hitler as a counter to the theory that the rise of Nazism was unique to the economic/political climate of the time. His thesis is that the seeds of Hitler had long been festering in Germany.
“After 2008, the banks and bankers and equities were saved and the people were cast into a sea of sharks. Many Americans descended into despair. Out of that long-building despair arose Trump.”
Funny how it was largely white people who were sharp enough to pick up on that level of despair, isn’t it?
“As for not accepting the election, Democrats generally did not accept the outcome of the 2016 election, and used “Russian collusion” as a means to initiate a soft coup.”
That is the biggest load of Trumpist rubbish yet. Impeachment according to constitutional principles and procedures is not a coup, soft or otherwise.
No RB, his argument is much more insidious than the supposed impropriety of the (constitutionally justified) impeachment of Trumpolini.
It’s that the widespread alarm over reports of the FBI’s opening an investigation into whether Trump’s 2016 campaign was penetrated by Russian intelligence was really a “coup” by Dems, despite the fact that most DC Repubs promised in early 2017 that they also wanted to “get to the bottom” of the facts of the Russia probe, and uniformly praised the appointment of Mueller as a special counsel by Rosenstein in May, 2017, after (Repub) AG Sessions had to recuse himself as a result of HIS Russia connections. The absurd “argument” is that “Russiagate” was totally a Dem/Deep State hoax from start to finish, despite it being overseen by Trump’s DOJ and presided over by a Repub ex-director, (until then) a universally respected figure on Capitol Hill.
This revisionism makes the revisionism of Hitler’s “stab in the back” look credible…and tame!
That a sadistic, mentally unbalanced childish ignoramus like Donald Trump could come to start a reactionary revolutionary cult is rather improbable. But then, so was Hitler, I suppose. Both men were poorly educated narcissists, drunk with delusions of their own “greatness”, both utterly unqualified to be national leaders of Monaco, let alone a world power. But they said what rightwing reactionary citizens wanted to hear, and that was more than enough for the failed electorates that granted them executive power.
Hitler had national resentment over Versailles and the Great Depression to propel him into power, Trump had nothing so strong as that, howevermuch some see widespread “despair” in his 74 million followers. And “follower” is the only possible term for them, given their devotion to (indeed, adoration of!) the loathsome Trump, despite his multitudinous failures, corruption and epic lawbreaking in office.
The real objection of the 74 million (mostly white) Trumpite followers is that Biden won with the votes of those demographics that don’t “count” as Real Americans. Hence the (openly racist) focus at the end of Trumpolini’s “strategy” to throw out or discount the votes of urban Atlanta, Detroit, Philadelphia and Milwaukee. That’s what galls these Trumpists, as well as the Repub party that almost uniformly enabled Trump’s absurd “stabbed in the back” argument. We’ll see how much McConnell, McCarthy and the plutocrats’ ReichsRadio now use this handy myth in coming years. An apparatchik like the unctuous Newt G always knows where his next wingnut welfare check is coming from, and is usually an adept early adopter of the Next Big Lie. It’s his only talent!
So, far from actual reform of voting rights and procedures, what we will see in future across the states of Trumpland will be substantial retrograde movement in voting rights, with the democratically-illegitimate Trump majority on the Supreme Court not only backing the American right’s disenfranchisement schemes in Red States, but also allowing it to be imposed it in Blue/Purple states as well, like MI and PA. Trump’s “stab in the back” myth will be a long term calamity for American democracy. This is because the conservative movement knows it cannot win the popular vote again (and isn’t even going to try), but it also cannot allow the 2020 result to happen again, either.
There are now far, far too many in the US of A who are openly opposed to actual democracy to fantasize that it will be able to continue in this country in any reputable form. And Snyder is surely right to prophesy that development.
Sorry, this was not meant as a “reply” to WHD’s comment.
Not to mention based on Justice Department Investigations, Mueller made it clear that There was impropriety, but that its policy not to indict a sitting president.
Hitler Hitler Hitler!
Russia Russia Russia!
Putin Putin Putin!
Nazi Nazi Nazi!
I’m not the one here hyperbolically pounding on the table. (One might begin to imagine Biden lost, the vehemence of these arguments.)
Um, even a cursory glance at the thread indicates that you were the one to first bring up Russia and Putin….as a false equivalence for Trump’s current “stab in the back” claim of election “theft”.
Well, it sure does seem like you are the main character promoting the conspiracy theories:
“As for not accepting the election, Democrats generally did not accept the outcome of the 2016 election, and used “Russian collusion” as a means to initiate a soft coup. So the precedent was set.”
As prior, OK to prosecute kids from South of the Border, but T*****, with a record of fraud not OK. Yeah we get it, all conspiracy when the dude has a long record. Reminder: T**** U, T**** charitable foundation. Some of us may be old, but are memory isn’t that foggy!
PS: Here is just another new scam on the long list:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/75percent-of-every-donation-to-trumps-election-defense-fund-could-actually-be-spent-by-the-president-himself-on-things-like-paying-family-members-or-financing-a-2024-bid/ar-BB1bk7xD?li=BBnb7Kz
While Hitler and Nazism were part of the subject of the article, *you* raised the issue of Russia–the only other references to Russia are in response to you. Your ‘Putin! Putin! Putin!” comment is, as of this moment, the only reference to Putin anywhere on this page.
You are in fact hyperbolically pounding on your own straw man argument.
When it comes to Trump it is either Russia, Putin. Nazi, Hitler repeated in these pages ad nauseam.
Doubling down on the straw man and unwilling to address any of the ideas presented in the article other than “Dems are bad too!”.
Got it.
I used to try to understand what you were trying to say, but I honestly haven’t been able to discern anything other than the fact that you think the Republican party is bad (even worse than the terrible Democrats!), but the success of the Republican party is largely due to how terrible the Democratic party is.
What *is* your argument, and more specifically, what do you propose?
Well, we could start by not taking part in calling everyone on the Other Side a Nazi or a Communist/Satanist. Second, we could practice that wisdom that suggests we not focus on the sliver in the Other eye when we have a plank in our own, which politically is to suggest, railing on about the evil of Republicans is not going to change Republicans, but focusing on my own presumptions about what the Democratic Party has become (if I am a Democrat) might have an effect of Dems.
We all have the responsibility of personal accountability. We as Americans have a duty to protect and take care of America, if we value citizenship and freedom. What America needs right now is more love, empathy and compassion, and less war, abuse of power, and hatred.
No one else is pounding on the table. People are simply relying on facts and evidence.
For the record, I see Trump and Republicans as one side of a polar sided illness in America called imperialism. Meanwhile, while you all obsess about Trump as Hitler, Biden is filling his cabinet with war hawks who specialize in uniting with Bush era neoconservatives, for what is likely to be a continuation of Obama era laying waste to nations/regime change/spreading democracy, ala Libya, Syria and Ukraine.
The comparison between the Democrats not accepting the election in 2016, where Clinton quickly conceded and Trump praised Obama for his cooperation, are absurd.
As far as Russia goes, even the Republicans have acknowledged the interference. This isn’t about Republicans vs. Democrats. Its about evidence and truth vs. Russian propaganda and lies.
I am quite sure that Newt and the rest of gang like McConnell, Graham, Pompeo, Rush, Don Jr., etc. all the way down to the state hacks like Carnahan and Kiffmeyer have no belief that Trump was cheated out of this election. Rather, for political or monetary reasons they’ve decided it’s in their best interests to keep the charade going. Whatever belief they have in democratic principles is secondary to their main aim: making sure that Democrats, not only progressives but old-fashioned liberals, are defeated by whatever means necessary. If it means disenfranchising thousands of black voters in Wayne County by putting pressure on a couple of white guys to give them a Hail Mary reprieve, they’re all fine with it.
It is unbelievable how brazenly they put themselves and their party first, ahead of any national interest that would work for the benefit of the average person. Thus, the pandemic is not only ignored in the White House but resistance to measures to mitigate it is encouraged. Relief for small businesses is not only ignored, but measures to help are being actively thwarted by Mnuchin. People who are going hungry and being evicted are on their own. More ominously, Pompeo, MBS, and Netanyahu are having secret meetings. Gee, I wonder if some sort of action against Iran is being contemplated just before Trump leaves for a permanent golfing vacation giving Biden a major headache with which to deal by kneecapping any nuclear deal.
They knew birtherism was nonsense too, but rode the tiger while they figured it would help them. Utterly feckless cowards all of them.
As we review what Germans might have been thinking in 1918 relative to the 30s, it might be helpful to review our own recent past.
Looking at the 2016 election, in particular, the primaries, we saw two insurgent challengers, Sanders and Trump. In the Dem side, party leadership expected Sanders supporters to naturally migrate to Clinton in the general. Instead, exit polling showed that many actually supported Trump in the general.
Winding the clock back a little further to 2009, the Obama-Biden administration chose to bail out the bankers that created the mess, while leaving thousands of individuals to the vagaries of bankruptcy. Yes, at least the ACA’s passage means fewer will go to bankruptcy for health reasons; but overall middle/working class voters are struggling to get buy, seeing limited gains for hard work.
Trump capitalized on this raw deal, albeit with false promises. Dems still haven’t figured out an effective message for reconnecting with these voters.
I don’t know enough about Germany in the 20s & 30s to draw appropriate comparisons. But what I see in the US now are a lot of people busting their asses to get by, never catching a break from the system. Trump promised change, but sold them out. Most haven’t realized it yet. But come January we’ll hear renewed zeal for fighting the deficit from the Republicans who voted in lockstep for Trump’s tax cuts for high earners & spending increases for big business.
A conversion to tyranny would necessarily involve a whole bunch of enablers.
Unfortunately, the Republican party membership has been serving as enablers for decades now.
Literally.
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/21449634/republicans-supreme-court-gop-trump-authoritarian
There’s the literary device where the main character has no import at all, but simply causes those around him to reveal who they are.
Trump is of almost cosmic emptiness: barren of any feature that we associate with a developed human character. From the moment he rode down the elevator to now, he has been entirely unimportant: without those who have protected, ennabled and justified him, he would have been only a farcical figure and not the destructive force he has been. What he has revealed is the amorality, cravenness, cowardice and parasitic attachment to power – the authoritarianism, decades in the making – of the protectors, ennablers and apologists that populate his party. And that’s why his departure is a step back from the precipice, but not at all the end of our crisis.
Thank you for this, Charles. This is perfectly boiled down to the essence of our moment: back from the brink, but now we see in what frightening peril we reside. Though it sounds like an epic understatement, we have much to do.
“Democrats generally did not accept the outcome of the 2016 election”? I have seen no evidence of Dems not “accepting” the outcome. Plenty of evidence that they did not like it – but it was accepted as reality.
What Trump is doing by spuriously casting doubt on the validity of the election tears at the fabric of democracy. When you lose faith in the the validity of elections you have anarchy. Trumps actions are tantamount to sedition. Those Republican cowards who put their near term job security ahead of the best interest of the country are equally guilty.
I don’t know what we would do without Yale historians and their mundane observations? Now that we’ve covered the bloody obvious do we have anything substantive to discuss? What I’d really like to know is whether or not Snyder was one of the historians that promised us Trump was no Fascist back in 2015-2016?
For my part, I would say that anyone who want’s to make “deals” of any kind with Trump and anyone in his cabinet (not to mention congressional supporters) that might put them beyond prosecution should note the obvious here… making deals with Fascists has never ended well, and Fascists are the last people in the universe you ever want to feel immune or beyond the reach of justice.
Snyder was one who early on (certainly soon after the 2016 election) was sympathetic to seeing Trump’s anti-democratic and authoritarian tendencies and warning that one must take note of the “patterns of history” when asked about Nazi/fascist comparisons to Trumpolini. He’s pretty much called out Trump’s post-election gambit of the past 3 weeks as Fascism 101.
Goodwin’s Law: The more heated a political argument becomes, the higher the likelihood that one side will mention Adolf Hitler. Whoever mentions Hitler first, loses the argument.
Our country will never be like the Nazi’s and Hitler…ever. All the arguments that show ‘similarities’ are just empty. In politics, the Nazis came to power because there is only one legislative body. We have the executive and Congress with solid oversight by a separate judicial. It is impossible to overcome all three by one single person.
Add to it that what the Nazi’s did is probably the most horrible to mankind. There is no comparison.
Those that compare anyone to this brutal group have no credibility.
I haven’t seen anyone compare Trump to Hitler although many have pointed to Trump as an American Fascist.
Trump’s Fascist tendencies have been obvious throughout his presidency and anyone who denies that fact has a credibility problem at this point. His attempts to declare himself president, or get someone else to declare him president, regardless of the election outcome simply cannot be described any other way, that’s Fascism 101 as someone has already pointed out.
We have simply been lucky that our first Fascist president is a buffoon who can’t organize a one man parade, or run anything competently. Should our luck run out before we’ve crushed this flirtation with Dictatorship, we may find ourselves fighting rather than simply voting to defend our freedoms. Anyone who dismisses this threat out of hand is playing a potentially deadly game of denial.
It’s rather a shame there’s no “law” equally applicable to American “conservatives” calling the other person a “socialist” or “communist” when the arguments “grow heated”. I guess we couldn’t have such a law or conservatives wouldn’t have much to say to their Dem opponents….just ask Biden, AOC and Omar!
As for your complacent view that “It can’t happen here!”, that all depends upon what the “it” is. We have a constitution that permits lengthy rule by a minority faction, via the absurd electoral college and the inequitable composition of the senate. We just had this unprincipled minority faction push through a (third) democratically illegitimate justice on the very eve of the election, wrongfully packing the nation’s highest court with far-rightwing conservatives, when the majority of the citizenry NEVER voted for such a result. We just had a minority faction president baselessly declare that the election results (across six or more states that he lost) was “rigged” and the product of mass voter fraud, and that if the votes of Blue cities with significant minority demographics were “properly” thrown out, he actually “won” (again, via the anti-democratic electoral college). We have about 80% of the supporters of this “president” believing the above lies and nonsense, despite what the courts and media say. So we already have one of our two major parties openly giving up on majority rule and declaring that rule by an authoritarian minority faction, backed up by an illegitimate Supreme Court majority, is their vision for the future. So as far as rising fascism goes, it already HAS happened here.
Finally, you need to brush up a little on Weimar Germany, which was a modern parliamentary democracy. The fact that it had just one house of parliament, the Reichstag (while we have two chambers), hardly makes the slightest difference to an ability to oppose an aspiring dictator, especially one that has a fully enabling party in said legislature, which Trumpolini (for example) certainly did. The Weimar Republic had a legislative, an executive (both a president and a chancellor), and a judicial branch. Its fatal flaw, I suppose, was that there were mechanisms for “emergency” rule by decree, which Hitler seized upon after the Reichstag fire. But as for the rest, we are at least as susceptible to capture by authoritarian forces as any modern democracy; and in my view, actually moreso, given our archaic (and obviously failed) 18th Century constitution. If Trumpolini isn’t a screaming warning siren, I don’t know what is.
The fact that 47% of our failed citizenry just clamored for this monster to have a second term pretty much is the final proof of the analogy…
“We have the executive and Congress with solid oversight by a separate judicial. It is impossible to overcome all three by one single person.”
Just an FYI:
Our newest Senator from Alabama could not name the 3 branches of government.
Senator / Coach Tuberville probably could tell us the pros and cons of a Cover 2 defense vs a Cover 4 though.